Single Payer Push

SoxIlliniRob wrote:

alohafri wrote:



The health care coverage is one of the main benefits of being a teacher. Sorry if you think it's selfish to want to hold on to that like grim death.

It's not at all selfish to want the best for your family!  I don't mean to imply otherwise.  But I think we need, as a society, to decide what our national societal priorities are.  If we view ensuring equal access to healthcare and medicine as a priority, then we shouldn't expect any such achievement to come without sacrifice, be it cost or hassle or both.  

Pam always hands off her annual benefits re-enrollment to me to handle, and usually asks me "are we making any changes or can I just check the box to leave it as is?"  I always say "I don't plan to make any changes", and then that's the last I hear of it.  Pam isn't a details person on stuff like this, so I can assure you that she is NOT filling out a new application or some kind of long, re-enrollment process.  She'd most surely pass that off on me, and she hasn't.  

Now, back to the discussion of societal priorities and sacrifice.  I'm constantly taken aback by the argument that single payer will create "rationing of care."  This comes across to me as similar to saying that ending world hunger might mean I can't have as much food as I currently eat.  Isn't a concern for rationed care another way of saying "I want to carve 10% to 30% of Americans out of the healthcare process so that I never have to wait longer for my medical service?  THAT strikes me as selfish.  It amazes me that people say this with a straight face, some of whom are Christians or some other religion that purports to love one another.  Isn't rationed care the whole idea, i.e. I want everyone to have the same access that Pam and I have, even if it means I might get a little less?  Or have to wait a little longer?

alohafri wrote:


Chris Coons was on MSNBC yesterday (the only time I ever watch any of that type of program is at the health club because that's all they have on) and he was talking with the host, whoever she was, about the GOP using Sanders' push for single payer as a rallying cry for the current proposal (Graham/Cassidy I think). Coons seemed to be against both single payer and Graham/Cassidy, saying that there are at least two bipartisan bills being produced that many governors, both D and R, seem to be getting behind. 


On a related note, you watch this crap. Have you seen Elizabeth MacDonald on Fox Business (another channel they seem to run constantly...maybe I need a new health club)? If she isn't the meanest looking woman on television, I don't know who is. And you can put her in front of a projector and run a movie on her forehead like a drive in movie.

SoxIlliniRob wrote:I guess I just find myself perplexed on this topic sometimes.  I hear a guy like Nomads sounding unsure about single payer, even though HE IS ON SINGLE PAYER (not picking on you, Jim...just using you as a generic example to make a point).  I hear folks on this board or other boards who are vehemently against single payer (sometimes for fair reasons!) but they aren't at all against Medicare, which they'll be on in 5, 10, or 15 yrs.  Kark is renowned for giving his thousand reasons why single payer cannot and will not work, even though Medicare actually WORKS.  My father in law, a hard conservative who is on Medicare, rants endlessly about how terrible single payer would be even though he absolutely LOVES his single payer, gov't coverage. 

SoxIlliniRob wrote:Medicare and VA are government funded.  That is single payer, with the US Treasury being the payer.

SoxIlliniRob wrote:Seeing as how the US Govt is your primary payer, how is it working for you?

Nomads44 wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:Seeing as how the US Govt is your primary payer, how is it working for you?

Very well, thank you.

alohafri wrote:The VA seems to be working so well!

sharpy wrote:VA does actually work pretty well. First large organization to have electronic medical records so your info is available everywhere in the US. Meds are much cheaper. Medicine is guideline and not for profit driven, and if they cannot provide a service they willingly cover care at a local hospital that does. Problems they have are all financial. They aren't funded enough. Why? Nobody wants their taxes to go up to fund the vets just like they don't want taxes to go up to fund people they feel are "unworthy". Just another example of our national "Christian" values. That's why "support the troops" is just marketing to make everyone feel better about young kids dying. If everyone "supported" the troops there wouldn't be any VA issues. BTW- we are one week away from 32 million people losing their healthcare, women being denigrated yet again, and pre-existing conditions fucking you for the rest of your lives. Thank God the meek will walk into the kingdom of heaven because the GOP Christians are making it easier to get there. 

sharpy wrote: BTW- we are one week away from 32 million people losing their healthcare, women being denigrated yet again, and pre-existing conditions fucking you for the rest of your lives. Thank God the meek will walk into the kingdom of heaven because the GOP Christians are making it easier to get there. 

sharpy wrote:VA does actually work pretty well. First large organization to have electronic medical records so your info is available everywhere in the US. Meds are much cheaper. Medicine is guideline and not for profit driven, and if they cannot provide a service they willingly cover care at a local hospital that does. Problems they have are all financial. They aren't funded enough. Why? Nobody wants their taxes to go up to fund the vets just like they don't want taxes to go up to fund people they feel are "unworthy". Just another example of our national "Christian" values. That's why "support the troops" is just marketing to make everyone feel better about young kids dying. If everyone "supported" the troops there wouldn't be any VA issues. BTW- we are one week away from 32 million people losing their healthcare, women being denigrated yet again, and pre-existing conditions fucking you for the rest of your lives. Thank God the meek will walk into the kingdom of heaven because the GOP Christians are making it easier to get there. 

frank bonifacic wrote:


As an aside, I feel that the number of organizations and funds "to support the vets"-(wounded warriors, etc) is an absolute disgrace. And not just because so many of them pay a very high percentage of what they collect in "administration costs and salaries).
There should NEVER be the need for ANY organization or funds to assist the vets. IT SHOULD BE UNQUESTIONED THAT THE GOVERNMENT TAKE CARE OF ANY AND ALL VET PROBLEMS. That any of those would be needed is shameful! 

alohafri wrote:

frank bonifacic wrote:


As an aside, I feel that the number of organizations and funds "to support the vets"-(wounded warriors, etc) is an absolute disgrace. And not just because so many of them pay a very high percentage of what they collect in "administration costs and salaries).
There should NEVER be the need for ANY organization or funds to assist the vets. IT SHOULD BE UNQUESTIONED THAT THE GOVERNMENT TAKE CARE OF ANY AND ALL VET PROBLEMS. That any of those would be needed is shameful! 

Agreed! I hope I don't sound like I'm badmouthing the VA. One of my best friend's wife is a nurse at Hines and a bartender friend of mine has her full time job as an administrator at Hines (she was helpful to me when my dad was dying last year). The VA was better for my dad in arranging his funeral than Medicare was in his nursing home care.

alohafri wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:

alohafri wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:

Well, you didn't call me a clueless cunt or cocksucking shmuck from St. Chuck, so we're off to a good start.  And for the record, if I'm going to hit on you I'll go directly to your Grindr profile page and swipe right.

WTF is a "Grindr"?

Tinder for gay folks.

Which leads to my next question. What's a "Tinder"? LOL

sharpy wrote:here should NEVER be the need for ANY organization or funds to assist the vets. IT SHOULD BE UNQUESTIONED THAT THE GOVERNMENT TAKE CARE OF ANY AND ALL VET PROBLEMS. That any of those would be needed is shameful! 


Absolutely correct Frank. I get aggravated with the "Support the Troops" lip service when all it might be is applauding some soldier at a ballgame. I think if you put yourself in harms way for this country, the country owes you. 

blondy28 wrote:I see Trump is planning on signing an executive order for Health Care.

SoxIlliniRob wrote:

blondy28 wrote:I see Trump is planning on signing an executive order for Health Care.

LOL.  I heard him saying something about that, too.  If there's a way for him to ruin something with Obama's name on it, he's gonna try doing it.  Maybe he'll just issue an executive order declaring ACA against the law or something, and then we can watch the entire GOP suddenly begin defending the honor of executive orders.  He's already doing everything in his power to put ACA into a death spiral with dumping the mandate and no longer using their ad budget to get people (healthy people!) to sign up.

as an aside, HHS just cancelled their 4-5 visits to Mississippi where they have met with the Medicaid people and have forums on enrolling for health care, etc.  When Mississippi head asked for resumes of attendees so could republish received note saying trips cancelled (couple days before) Just trying to show it is failing (lol)


While I'm on this topic, do we even know what the GOP stands for anymore?  Absolute nutcase crackpot Judge Roy Moore (gay behavior ought to be illegal, Muslims shouldn't be allowed to run for office, evolution is a hoax) is going to win a senate seat in Alabama in a couple of months.  The new tax plan proposal is being rated by an independent agency as RAISING taxes on the middle class and dramatically lowering them on the rich, while blowing a HUGE hole in the deficit.  For eight years, I heard nothing but complaining about the deficits and the debt under Obama.  Now, it's a non-issue, even though Trump and the GOP are trying to grow the deficit with these cuts and growing the military.  The only thing I view the GOP as being steadfast on is being anti-abortion.  Nothing else appears sacred.  They are their own worst enemies.  

With where I think our demographics are going over the next ten years, I believe this administration is possibly the last gasp of the selfish, dickish monster of the Reaganomics/Trickle Down era.  This election of nutjob Trump seems to me like it's the monster getting up at the end of the movie and making one last stand before being pushed over the cliff.  Trump lies, insults, boasts, cheats...and his base of 38% love him for it.  It can't possibly keep up this way.  It just can't.  The younger generation hates this dick, and the folks that support him.  It might get violent for a while (as Cream and Sharpy sometimes imply), but I honestly think this is a part of the larger equation of becoming a much nicer place.

frank bonifacic wrote:

as an aside, HHS just cancelled their 4-5 visits to Mississippi where they have met with the Medicaid people and have forums on enrolling for health care, etc.  When Mississippi head asked for resumes of attendees so could republish received note saying trips cancelled (couple days before) Just trying to show it is failing (lol)