Student Loan Debt Forgivenness

I haven't any idea if this is true or holds water, but there are some pretty significant rumors floating around about Biden planning an executive order after inauguration whereby he'll give everyone with student debt up to a $50k waiver that they can use to pay off some or all of their student loan debt.  

First, I didn't know this was something a president could do...issue an executive order of this type.  Seems like an expenditure without congressional approval.  Then again, Obama pushed the limits and sometimes got away with it, and Trump pushed those limits well beyond anything Obama tried.  I believe it's money due to banks, and those loans are backed by a government guarantee.  Ordinarily, if the student defaults, the gov't repays the bank and then the gov't holds a note due from from the student.  When the gov't owns a note due that's an asset and I guess Biden in this case would be waving the note being due.  Maybe when you're choosing to waive some $$ due, that's different from *spending* funds.  

Second, there'll probably be contrasting views from folks who paid their loans in full versus those who still owe versus those who never had any.  

Imagine if you recently wrote a huge check to pay off a bunch of student loan debt and then this happens.

Lastly, I saw that there are a few political strategists who are gravely concerned that this will cause a bloodbath for Biden in the midterms.  It'll certainly excite millennials and younger.  It might excite a few middle agers who are paying for their kids' loans.  Overall, I'm not sure it adds to the Biden base a whole lot, but it likely generates excitement among that base.  There's the argument from some that you don't do this unless it grows your base, and there's the other argument that you do it because it's a way to bring spending power to people who will spend every dollar of the money they save.  It's a shift of the flow of money from consumer to banks over to consumer to the goods and services marketplace.  For four years, Trump did whatever would excite his base without any fucking regard for what anyone else thought.  I guess if Biden does this, it's similar.  It sure didn't seem to hurt Trump.  Trump would have won if not for being a fuck up in dealing with Covid.

SoxIlliniRob wrote:I haven't any idea if this is true or holds water, but there are some pretty significant rumors floating around about Biden planning an executive order after inauguration whereby he'll give everyone with student debt up to a $50k waiver that they can use to pay off some or all of their student loan debt.  

First, I didn't know this was something a president could do...issue an executive order of this type.  Seems like an expenditure without congressional approval.  Then again, Obama pushed the limits and sometimes got away with it, and Trump pushed those limits well beyond anything Obama tried.  I believe it's money due to banks, and those loans are backed by a government guarantee.  Ordinarily, if the student defaults, the gov't repays the bank and then the gov't holds a note due from from the student.  When the gov't owns a note due that's an asset and I guess Biden in this case would be waving the note being due.  Maybe when you're choosing to waive some $$ due, that's different from *spending* funds.  

Second, there'll probably be contrasting views from folks who paid their loans in full versus those who still owe versus those who never had any.  

Imagine if you recently wrote a huge check to pay off a bunch of student loan debt and then this happens.

Lastly, I saw that there are a few political strategists who are gravely concerned that this will cause a bloodbath for Biden in the midterms.  It'll certainly excite millennials and younger.  It might excite a few middle agers who are paying for their kids' loans.  Overall, I'm not sure it adds to the Biden base a whole lot, but it likely generates excitement among that base.  There's the argument from some that you don't do this unless it grows your base, and there's the other argument that you do it because it's a way to bring spending power to people who will spend every dollar of the money they save.  It's a shift of the flow of money from consumer to banks over to consumer to the goods and services marketplace.  For four years, Trump did whatever would excite his base without any fucking regard for what anyone else thought.  I guess if Biden does this, it's similar.  It sure didn't seem to hurt Trump.  Trump would have won if not for being a fuck up in dealing with Covid.

I read about how Biden would be able to do this with executive order, and I'm too lazy to find the article.  If memory serves, it wasn't total forgiveness.  Funny how people have no problem with the government giving billions of dollars to Walmart, oil companies, etc. in subsidies but not students, who may never be able own a house or buy a car because of student loan debt, yet all of us are paying half of the annual budgets of Kentucky, Mississippi, and Louisiana.  

I think the loudest voices against this are the people who paid off their student loans, and I'm too lazy to look this up, but I would argue wages and inflation.  In 2018 the cost of college was increasing 8 times faster than the rate of wages.  So someone who may have already paid off their loans made more money and had smaller loans.  So let Biden forgive the difference.  I've been on my own since I was 19, making $5.25/hour.  It was standard that companies had tuition reimbursement and health insurance was 100% company paid, with a $250 deductible.  My husband's company just hired a kid my kids went to school with.  He has a 4-year degree, from a university in South Carolina, I believe.  He's making $12 an hour and has to pay for his own health insurance plus student loan payment and maybe a car payment.  I know there are ways to reduce the amount of money you borrow, but even doing that it's still more expensive to fund school and you get paid less when you come out.  And there are jobs that didn't require college back in the 80s that does now.  My nephew had to get a 4-year degree to be a cop.  Admins need degrees.  This is simply not sustainable.

blondy28 wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:I haven't any idea if this is true or holds water, but there are some pretty significant rumors floating around about Biden planning an executive order after inauguration whereby he'll give everyone with student debt up to a $50k waiver that they can use to pay off some or all of their student loan debt.  

First, I didn't know this was something a president could do...issue an executive order of this type.  Seems like an expenditure without congressional approval.  Then again, Obama pushed the limits and sometimes got away with it, and Trump pushed those limits well beyond anything Obama tried.  I believe it's money due to banks, and those loans are backed by a government guarantee.  Ordinarily, if the student defaults, the gov't repays the bank and then the gov't holds a note due from from the student.  When the gov't owns a note due that's an asset and I guess Biden in this case would be waving the note being due.  Maybe when you're choosing to waive some $$ due, that's different from *spending* funds.  

Second, there'll probably be contrasting views from folks who paid their loans in full versus those who still owe versus those who never had any.  

Imagine if you recently wrote a huge check to pay off a bunch of student loan debt and then this happens.

Lastly, I saw that there are a few political strategists who are gravely concerned that this will cause a bloodbath for Biden in the midterms.  It'll certainly excite millennials and younger.  It might excite a few middle agers who are paying for their kids' loans.  Overall, I'm not sure it adds to the Biden base a whole lot, but it likely generates excitement among that base.  There's the argument from some that you don't do this unless it grows your base, and there's the other argument that you do it because it's a way to bring spending power to people who will spend every dollar of the money they save.  It's a shift of the flow of money from consumer to banks over to consumer to the goods and services marketplace.  For four years, Trump did whatever would excite his base without any fucking regard for what anyone else thought.  I guess if Biden does this, it's similar.  It sure didn't seem to hurt Trump.  Trump would have won if not for being a fuck up in dealing with Covid.

I read about how Biden would be able to do this with executive order, and I'm too lazy to find the article.  If memory serves, it wasn't total forgiveness.  Funny how people have no problem with the government giving billions of dollars to Walmart, oil companies, etc. in subsidies but not students, who may never be able own a house or buy a car because of student loan debt, yet all of us are paying half of the annual budgets of Kentucky, Mississippi, and Louisiana.  

I think the loudest voices against this are the people who paid off their student loans, and I'm too lazy to look this up, but I would argue wages and inflation.  In 2018 the cost of college was increasing 8 times faster than the rate of wages.  So someone who may have already paid off their loans made more money and had smaller loans.  So let Biden forgive the difference.  I've been on my own since I was 19, making $5.25/hour.  It was standard that companies had tuition reimbursement and health insurance was 100% company paid, with a $250 deductible.  My husband's company just hired a kid my kids went to school with.  He has a 4-year degree, from a university in South Carolina, I believe.  He's making $12 an hour and has to pay for his own health insurance plus student loan payment and maybe a car payment.  I know there are ways to reduce the amount of money you borrow, but even doing that it's still more expensive to fund school and you get paid less when you come out.  And there are jobs that didn't require college back in the 80s that does now.  My nephew had to get a 4-year degree to be a cop.  Admins need degrees.  This is simply not sustainable.

You forgot to mention the billions in aid we give to farmers, too.  I'm not really at a point where I'm ready to argue pro/con on this.  I see why they might do this.  I see the counterarguments against it.  Both have some merit. If he does this in the end, it'll be because the political calculus decided it's worth it, and because they figure that for every dollar of monthly student loan payments they waive off, 95 cents of that comes back into the economy in the form of spending on goods and services.  Stimulative spending, basically.

SoxIlliniRob wrote:

blondy28 wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:I haven't any idea if this is true or holds water, but there are some pretty significant rumors floating around about Biden planning an executive order after inauguration whereby he'll give everyone with student debt up to a $50k waiver that they can use to pay off some or all of their student loan debt.  

First, I didn't know this was something a president could do...issue an executive order of this type.  Seems like an expenditure without congressional approval.  Then again, Obama pushed the limits and sometimes got away with it, and Trump pushed those limits well beyond anything Obama tried.  I believe it's money due to banks, and those loans are backed by a government guarantee.  Ordinarily, if the student defaults, the gov't repays the bank and then the gov't holds a note due from from the student.  When the gov't owns a note due that's an asset and I guess Biden in this case would be waving the note being due.  Maybe when you're choosing to waive some $$ due, that's different from *spending* funds.  

Second, there'll probably be contrasting views from folks who paid their loans in full versus those who still owe versus those who never had any.  

Imagine if you recently wrote a huge check to pay off a bunch of student loan debt and then this happens.

Lastly, I saw that there are a few political strategists who are gravely concerned that this will cause a bloodbath for Biden in the midterms.  It'll certainly excite millennials and younger.  It might excite a few middle agers who are paying for their kids' loans.  Overall, I'm not sure it adds to the Biden base a whole lot, but it likely generates excitement among that base.  There's the argument from some that you don't do this unless it grows your base, and there's the other argument that you do it because it's a way to bring spending power to people who will spend every dollar of the money they save.  It's a shift of the flow of money from consumer to banks over to consumer to the goods and services marketplace.  For four years, Trump did whatever would excite his base without any fucking regard for what anyone else thought.  I guess if Biden does this, it's similar.  It sure didn't seem to hurt Trump.  Trump would have won if not for being a fuck up in dealing with Covid.

I read about how Biden would be able to do this with executive order, and I'm too lazy to find the article.  If memory serves, it wasn't total forgiveness.  Funny how people have no problem with the government giving billions of dollars to Walmart, oil companies, etc. in subsidies but not students, who may never be able own a house or buy a car because of student loan debt, yet all of us are paying half of the annual budgets of Kentucky, Mississippi, and Louisiana.  

I think the loudest voices against this are the people who paid off their student loans, and I'm too lazy to look this up, but I would argue wages and inflation.  In 2018 the cost of college was increasing 8 times faster than the rate of wages.  So someone who may have already paid off their loans made more money and had smaller loans.  So let Biden forgive the difference.  I've been on my own since I was 19, making $5.25/hour.  It was standard that companies had tuition reimbursement and health insurance was 100% company paid, with a $250 deductible.  My husband's company just hired a kid my kids went to school with.  He has a 4-year degree, from a university in South Carolina, I believe.  He's making $12 an hour and has to pay for his own health insurance plus student loan payment and maybe a car payment.  I know there are ways to reduce the amount of money you borrow, but even doing that it's still more expensive to fund school and you get paid less when you come out.  And there are jobs that didn't require college back in the 80s that does now.  My nephew had to get a 4-year degree to be a cop.  Admins need degrees.  This is simply not sustainable.

You forgot to mention the billions in aid we give to farmers, too.  I'm not really at a point where I'm ready to argue pro/con on this.  I see why they might do this.  I see the counterarguments against it.  Both have some merit. If he does this in the end, it'll be because the political calculus decided it's worth it, and because they figure that for every dollar of monthly student loan payments they waive off, 95 cents of that comes back into the economy in the form of spending on goods and services.  Stimulative spending, basically.

I thought about mentioning the farmers.  And yes, it's stimulative spending, that most dems mentioned should be part of Covid stimulus.  How many times will the rich run us off into the ditch will it take before the GOP stops giving them more money that they claim will filter down to us, but never does.  I'm guessing they'll never stop it.  How these people have convinced the christians that the GOP is the party that's most aligned with jesus is baffling.  I guess the fact that the town where Liberty University resides voted for Biden is a reason to hope.

blondy28 wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:

blondy28 wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:I haven't any idea if this is true or holds water, but there are some pretty significant rumors floating around about Biden planning an executive order after inauguration whereby he'll give everyone with student debt up to a $50k waiver that they can use to pay off some or all of their student loan debt.  

First, I didn't know this was something a president could do...issue an executive order of this type.  Seems like an expenditure without congressional approval.  Then again, Obama pushed the limits and sometimes got away with it, and Trump pushed those limits well beyond anything Obama tried.  I believe it's money due to banks, and those loans are backed by a government guarantee.  Ordinarily, if the student defaults, the gov't repays the bank and then the gov't holds a note due from from the student.  When the gov't owns a note due that's an asset and I guess Biden in this case would be waving the note being due.  Maybe when you're choosing to waive some $$ due, that's different from *spending* funds.  

Second, there'll probably be contrasting views from folks who paid their loans in full versus those who still owe versus those who never had any.  

Imagine if you recently wrote a huge check to pay off a bunch of student loan debt and then this happens.

Lastly, I saw that there are a few political strategists who are gravely concerned that this will cause a bloodbath for Biden in the midterms.  It'll certainly excite millennials and younger.  It might excite a few middle agers who are paying for their kids' loans.  Overall, I'm not sure it adds to the Biden base a whole lot, but it likely generates excitement among that base.  There's the argument from some that you don't do this unless it grows your base, and there's the other argument that you do it because it's a way to bring spending power to people who will spend every dollar of the money they save.  It's a shift of the flow of money from consumer to banks over to consumer to the goods and services marketplace.  For four years, Trump did whatever would excite his base without any fucking regard for what anyone else thought.  I guess if Biden does this, it's similar.  It sure didn't seem to hurt Trump.  Trump would have won if not for being a fuck up in dealing with Covid.

I read about how Biden would be able to do this with executive order, and I'm too lazy to find the article.  If memory serves, it wasn't total forgiveness.  Funny how people have no problem with the government giving billions of dollars to Walmart, oil companies, etc. in subsidies but not students, who may never be able own a house or buy a car because of student loan debt, yet all of us are paying half of the annual budgets of Kentucky, Mississippi, and Louisiana.  

I think the loudest voices against this are the people who paid off their student loans, and I'm too lazy to look this up, but I would argue wages and inflation.  In 2018 the cost of college was increasing 8 times faster than the rate of wages.  So someone who may have already paid off their loans made more money and had smaller loans.  So let Biden forgive the difference.  I've been on my own since I was 19, making $5.25/hour.  It was standard that companies had tuition reimbursement and health insurance was 100% company paid, with a $250 deductible.  My husband's company just hired a kid my kids went to school with.  He has a 4-year degree, from a university in South Carolina, I believe.  He's making $12 an hour and has to pay for his own health insurance plus student loan payment and maybe a car payment.  I know there are ways to reduce the amount of money you borrow, but even doing that it's still more expensive to fund school and you get paid less when you come out.  And there are jobs that didn't require college back in the 80s that does now.  My nephew had to get a 4-year degree to be a cop.  Admins need degrees.  This is simply not sustainable.

You forgot to mention the billions in aid we give to farmers, too.  I'm not really at a point where I'm ready to argue pro/con on this.  I see why they might do this.  I see the counterarguments against it.  Both have some merit. If he does this in the end, it'll be because the political calculus decided it's worth it, and because they figure that for every dollar of monthly student loan payments they waive off, 95 cents of that comes back into the economy in the form of spending on goods and services.  Stimulative spending, basically.

I thought about mentioning the farmers.  And yes, it's stimulative spending, that most dems mentioned should be part of Covid stimulus.  How many times will the rich run us off into the ditch will it take before the GOP stops giving them more money that they claim will filter down to us, but never does.  I'm guessing they'll never stop it.  How these people have convinced the christians that the GOP is the party that's most aligned with jesus is baffling.  I guess the fact that the town where Liberty University resides voted for Biden is a reason to hope.

when you think about how the GOP just blows the fuck out of the deficit every time there's a Republican president, and then holds Dem feet to the fire over the deficit when there'd a Dem in office, maybe Biden is just thinking "Hey, we'll give them something they like and then we'll claim, just like they did in the case of confirming Barrett to the Court, that if you have political power and if it's not illegal, then you are ok to do it."  I think Dems are tired of Repubs murdering the deficit while they spend like drunken sailors and then the Dems can't do the same.  Maybe it's time for Dems to turn the tables and actually live up to the reputation they have.

SoxIlliniRob wrote:

blondy28 wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:

blondy28 wrote:

SoxIlliniRob wrote:I haven't any idea if this is true or holds water, but there are some pretty significant rumors floating around about Biden planning an executive order after inauguration whereby he'll give everyone with student debt up to a $50k waiver that they can use to pay off some or all of their student loan debt.  

First, I didn't know this was something a president could do...issue an executive order of this type.  Seems like an expenditure without congressional approval.  Then again, Obama pushed the limits and sometimes got away with it, and Trump pushed those limits well beyond anything Obama tried.  I believe it's money due to banks, and those loans are backed by a government guarantee.  Ordinarily, if the student defaults, the gov't repays the bank and then the gov't holds a note due from from the student.  When the gov't owns a note due that's an asset and I guess Biden in this case would be waving the note being due.  Maybe when you're choosing to waive some $$ due, that's different from *spending* funds.  

Second, there'll probably be contrasting views from folks who paid their loans in full versus those who still owe versus those who never had any.  

Imagine if you recently wrote a huge check to pay off a bunch of student loan debt and then this happens.

Lastly, I saw that there are a few political strategists who are gravely concerned that this will cause a bloodbath for Biden in the midterms.  It'll certainly excite millennials and younger.  It might excite a few middle agers who are paying for their kids' loans.  Overall, I'm not sure it adds to the Biden base a whole lot, but it likely generates excitement among that base.  There's the argument from some that you don't do this unless it grows your base, and there's the other argument that you do it because it's a way to bring spending power to people who will spend every dollar of the money they save.  It's a shift of the flow of money from consumer to banks over to consumer to the goods and services marketplace.  For four years, Trump did whatever would excite his base without any fucking regard for what anyone else thought.  I guess if Biden does this, it's similar.  It sure didn't seem to hurt Trump.  Trump would have won if not for being a fuck up in dealing with Covid.

I read about how Biden would be able to do this with executive order, and I'm too lazy to find the article.  If memory serves, it wasn't total forgiveness.  Funny how people have no problem with the government giving billions of dollars to Walmart, oil companies, etc. in subsidies but not students, who may never be able own a house or buy a car because of student loan debt, yet all of us are paying half of the annual budgets of Kentucky, Mississippi, and Louisiana.  

I think the loudest voices against this are the people who paid off their student loans, and I'm too lazy to look this up, but I would argue wages and inflation.  In 2018 the cost of college was increasing 8 times faster than the rate of wages.  So someone who may have already paid off their loans made more money and had smaller loans.  So let Biden forgive the difference.  I've been on my own since I was 19, making $5.25/hour.  It was standard that companies had tuition reimbursement and health insurance was 100% company paid, with a $250 deductible.  My husband's company just hired a kid my kids went to school with.  He has a 4-year degree, from a university in South Carolina, I believe.  He's making $12 an hour and has to pay for his own health insurance plus student loan payment and maybe a car payment.  I know there are ways to reduce the amount of money you borrow, but even doing that it's still more expensive to fund school and you get paid less when you come out.  And there are jobs that didn't require college back in the 80s that does now.  My nephew had to get a 4-year degree to be a cop.  Admins need degrees.  This is simply not sustainable.

You forgot to mention the billions in aid we give to farmers, too.  I'm not really at a point where I'm ready to argue pro/con on this.  I see why they might do this.  I see the counterarguments against it.  Both have some merit. If he does this in the end, it'll be because the political calculus decided it's worth it, and because they figure that for every dollar of monthly student loan payments they waive off, 95 cents of that comes back into the economy in the form of spending on goods and services.  Stimulative spending, basically.

I thought about mentioning the farmers.  And yes, it's stimulative spending, that most dems mentioned should be part of Covid stimulus.  How many times will the rich run us off into the ditch will it take before the GOP stops giving them more money that they claim will filter down to us, but never does.  I'm guessing they'll never stop it.  How these people have convinced the christians that the GOP is the party that's most aligned with jesus is baffling.  I guess the fact that the town where Liberty University resides voted for Biden is a reason to hope.

when you think about how the GOP just blows the fuck out of the deficit every time there's a Republican president, and then holds Dem feet to the fire over the deficit when there'd a Dem in office, maybe Biden is just thinking "Hey, we'll give them something they like and then we'll claim, just like they did in the case of confirming Barrett to the Court, that if you have political power and if it's not illegal, then you are ok to do it."  I think Dems are tired of Repubs murdering the deficit while they spend like drunken sailors and then the Dems can't do the same.  Maybe it's time for Dems to turn the tables and actually live up to the reputation they have.

For sure they should, because I'm certain that such spending will actually be GOOD for the country.  You would see improvement, which we never see with massive tax cuts which the GOP claims don't add to the deficit/debt.  The most basic principles.  Reasonable medical care results in healthier people.  Send drug addicts to rehab, not prison.   Didn't Trump just change the law that financial advisors don't have to act as a fiduciary?  Aside from the advisor, who thinks this does anything to help people?

blondy28 wrote:


For sure they should, because I'm certain that such spending will actually be GOOD for the country.  You would see improvement, which we never see with massive tax cuts which the GOP claims don't add to the deficit/debt.  The most basic principles.  Reasonable medical care results in healthier people.  Send drug addicts to rehab, not prison.   Didn't Trump just change the law that financial advisors don't have to act as a fiduciary?  Aside from the advisor, who thinks this does anything to help people?

True.  Doing this will immediately help about 45 million people and it'll help them in marked ways.  We're not talking about an extra $1000 a year in a tax return.  Some of these people are paying $400-500 a month on their student debt.  As much as $6k a year.  Most of the people paying that would be spending that money on goods and services.  Perhaps Biden says he's doing this unless there's a Covid stim bill that includes SOME student debt relief, along with other relief.  Maybe McConnell gets off his ass if it means the size of the debt waiver will only be 1/4 or 1/2 of what Biden is planning if they go through Congress.