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    Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

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    jaywit
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    Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by jaywit on Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:55 pm

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    SoxIlliniRob
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by SoxIlliniRob on Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:01 am

    Depressing read, Jay. I wonder if what he surmises about centrists stopping this war will ever be possible. Are there any centrists left? It seems there is only right wing and left wing. If someone is pro life they get lumped into the right wing. If I like the idea of single payer care, then I am the far left. Nobody is allowed to exist in the middle ground.
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    alohafri
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by alohafri on Fri Oct 05, 2018 7:06 am

    SoxIlliniRob wrote:Depressing read, Jay.  I wonder if what he surmises about centrists stopping this war will ever be possible.  Are there any centrists left?  It seems there is only right wing and left wing.  If someone is pro life they get lumped into the right wing.  If I like the idea of single payer care, then I am the far left.  Nobody is allowed to exist in the middle ground.

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    cream919
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by cream919 on Fri Oct 05, 2018 11:04 pm

    If progressives don't start growing a pair the south is going to win this time. Those Ol' White Boys been fightin' this war for 150 years!
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    blondy28
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by blondy28 on Sat Oct 06, 2018 1:48 pm

    SoxIlliniRob wrote:Depressing read, Jay.  I wonder if what he surmises about centrists stopping this war will ever be possible.  Are there any centrists left?  It seems there is only right wing and left wing.  If someone is pro life they get lumped into the right wing.  If I like the idea of single payer care, then I am the far left.  Nobody is allowed to exist in the middle ground.

    The middle ground changes...at least as it comes to progressive issues.  Even though the far right remain anti-gay marriage, it is certainly an issue that has gone from being far left to a middle/mainstream position.  I would say pot is one as well.  I can't think of many (any???) conservative issues that have shifted to become middle/moderate positions, rather, the right's platform is largely comprised of previously middle positions that have become far right positions.  I can think of very few in which that can be said about the left.  The one that immediately comes to mind is unions, which, as I recall, was perceived pretty well by main stream/middle class folks, whereas now, if you're pro-union, you're left wing/anti-capitalist.
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    SoxIlliniRob
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by SoxIlliniRob on Sat Oct 06, 2018 1:54 pm

    And that strikes me as nuts because union members comprised a big chunk of the Trump electorate.
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    alohafri
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by alohafri on Sat Oct 06, 2018 2:55 pm

    SoxIlliniRob wrote:And that strikes me as nuts because union members comprised a big chunk of the Trump electorate.

    I read somewhere (not sure where) that Trump is not personally against unions or union members. However, those that he appoints and supports for other parts of his agenda are.
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    SoxIlliniRob
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by SoxIlliniRob on Sat Oct 06, 2018 3:40 pm

    alohafri wrote:
    SoxIlliniRob wrote:And that strikes me as nuts because union members comprised a big chunk of the Trump electorate.

    I read somewhere (not sure where) that Trump is not personally against unions or union members. However, those that he appoints and supports for other parts of his agenda are.

    I only remember him during the campaign and during a debate saying that wages are already too high and they are the reason for so much unemployment.  Hard to imagine he's pro-union if he thinks wages are already too high.  Kev, I think he's saying you need to take a pay cut.
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    blondy28
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by blondy28 on Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:17 pm

    alohafri wrote:
    SoxIlliniRob wrote:And that strikes me as nuts because union members comprised a big chunk of the Trump electorate.

    I read somewhere (not sure where) that Trump is not personally against unions or union members. However, those that he appoints and supports for other parts of his agenda are.

    Trump also said he was pro-women and pro-LGBT.  I can't imagine Trump being pro-union given that he hires immigrants to work at his properties and his ties and hats are made in China with cheap labor.
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    sharpy
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by sharpy on Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:26 pm

    Whatever trump says he is, he is not. Unless he says he is a piece of shit - then he would be truthful 
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    alohafri
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by alohafri on Sun Oct 07, 2018 8:03 pm

    SoxIlliniRob wrote:
    alohafri wrote:
    SoxIlliniRob wrote:And that strikes me as nuts because union members comprised a big chunk of the Trump electorate.

    I read somewhere (not sure where) that Trump is not personally against unions or union members. However, those that he appoints and supports for other parts of his agenda are.

    I only remember him during the campaign and during a debate saying that wages are already too high and they are the reason for so much unemployment.  Hard to imagine he's pro-union if he thinks wages are already too high.  Kev, I think he's saying you need to take a pay cut.


    He wouldn't survive 20 minutes at my job. However, I could do his job better than he is at my current salary. My first two actions as President? Declaring Fox News and the Cubs "enemies of the state."
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    SoxIlliniRob
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by SoxIlliniRob on Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:02 pm

    alohafri wrote:

    He wouldn't survive 20 minutes at my job. However, I could do his job better than he is at my current salary. My first two actions as President? Declaring Fox News and the Cubs "enemies of the state."

    Nothing against you, Kevin.  I think you'd do a bang up job as president.  But I think ANYONE on this board would do a better job as president than he is because the members of this board have a general sense of intellectual curiosity and a sense of social responsibility.  He doesn't possess an ounce of either.

    jaywit
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by jaywit on Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:17 pm

    alohafri wrote:
    SoxIlliniRob wrote:Depressing read, Jay.  I wonder if what he surmises about centrists stopping this war will ever be possible.  Are there any centrists left?  It seems there is only right wing and left wing.  If someone is pro life they get lumped into the right wing.  If I like the idea of single payer care, then I am the far left.  Nobody is allowed to exist in the middle ground.

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    jaywit
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by jaywit on Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:26 pm

    SoxIlliniRob wrote:Depressing read, Jay.  I wonder if what he surmises about centrists stopping this war will ever be possible.  Are there any centrists left?  It seems there is only right wing and left wing.  If someone is pro life they get lumped into the right wing.  If I like the idea of single payer care, then I am the far left.  Nobody is allowed to exist in the middle ground.
    I've wondered about an independent presidential run for 2020 but, like you, I wonder if there are enough centrists left.  It seems everyone has chosen their side.  A centrist independent would likely garner very few votes today.  A lot can happen in 2 years, though.  Maybe there is a "silent majority" out there.


    Is it possible that an independent could win a few electoral votes in the hope that those electoral votes are taken out of Trump's pocket rather than the Democrat side?
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    SoxIlliniRob
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by SoxIlliniRob on Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:02 pm

    jaywit wrote:
    SoxIlliniRob wrote:Depressing read, Jay.  I wonder if what he surmises about centrists stopping this war will ever be possible.  Are there any centrists left?  It seems there is only right wing and left wing.  If someone is pro life they get lumped into the right wing.  If I like the idea of single payer care, then I am the far left.  Nobody is allowed to exist in the middle ground.
    I've wondered about an independent presidential run for 2020 but, like you, I wonder if there are enough centrists left.  It seems everyone has chosen their side.  A centrist independent would likely garner very few votes today.  A lot can happen in 2 years, though.  Maybe there is a "silent majority" out there.


    Is it possible that an independent could win a few electoral votes in the hope that those electoral votes are taken out of Trump's pocket rather than the Democrat side?

    It's probably safe to assume someone like Sasse or Flake or Kasich will try to run against Trump in the primaries.  Hard to imagine anyone overtaking Trump for the GOP nod, unless something very significant has come down the chute on the Mueller investigation whereby people begin buying into believing Trump did something terrible.  I don't see it happening.  

    After that, maybe one of those guys runs as an independent conservative, but they might take more votes away from the Dem than from Trump.  Trump's 40% or so will love him no matter what.  I can see Trump haters voting for some kind of Dem if it's only Dem vs. Trump, but that voter might go and vote for Sasse if he's a candidate.  Then, all of a sudden you have Trump at 42%, some Dem at 41% and Sasse at 17%, instead of Trump at 44% and some Dem at 50% and some no-name independent at 6%.
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    blondy28
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    Re: Someone else buying into Cream's prediction

    Post by blondy28 on Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:52 pm

    SoxIlliniRob wrote:
    alohafri wrote:

    He wouldn't survive 20 minutes at my job. However, I could do his job better than he is at my current salary. My first two actions as President? Declaring Fox News and the Cubs "enemies of the state."

    Nothing against you, Kevin.  I think you'd do a bang up job as president.  But I think ANYONE on this board would do a better job as president than he is because the members of this board have a general sense of intellectual curiosity and a sense of social responsibility.  He doesn't possess an ounce of either.

    Reading and saying please and thank you...that's about all it takes to be better than Trump.  The bar is mighty low.

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