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HOfers

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sharpy
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HOfers

Post by sharpy on Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:07 pm

Trammell and Morris ---not sure how I feel about this. I know rob, who is an exclusive guy probably isn't in favor of their election.  Argument is that Trammel is just the AL version of Larkin....so you ask, should Larkin be in??  And Morris is now the HOFer with the highest  ERA. Pitched some clutch games ..won 254 of them ...just never stood out as a HOFer..
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alohafri
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Re: HOfers

Post by alohafri on Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:31 am

sharpy wrote:Trammell and Morris ---not sure how I feel about this. I know rob, who is an exclusive guy probably isn't in favor of their election.  Argument is that Trammel is just the AL version of Larkin....so you ask, should Larkin be in??  And Morris is now the HOFer with the highest  ERA. Pitched some clutch games ..won 254 of them ...just never stood out as a HOFer..


This is the result of the new committees that look at certain "generations" of players. One one level, it makes sense to compare players with other players from their generation. If Cy Young is your measuring stick for being in the Hall of Fame, then no one makes it and no pitcher will ever make the Hall of Fame again with starters going only 5 or 6 innings tops. On the other hand, I also get your argument that could this make it the, as Todd used to call it, The Hall of Very Good.
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SoxIlliniRob
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Re: HOfers

Post by SoxIlliniRob on Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:24 am

I consider neither of them to be Greats of the Game. Just really good players from some very good teams, like Buehrle or Konerko. That said, I would actually enjoy a system that elects two former players per year, or one per year. Pick a number. And then it's never more, and never less. And if Morris is the best former player on the ballot in a given year, then he makes it.
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alohafri
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Re: HOfers

Post by alohafri on Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:10 am

SoxIlliniRob wrote:I consider neither of them to be Greats of the Game.  Just really good players from some very good teams, like Buehrle or Konerko.  That said, I would actually enjoy a system that elects two former players per year, or one per year.  Pick a number.  And then it's never more, and never less.  And if Morris is the best former player on the ballot in a given year, then he makes it.

Just curious, and unlike someone else we know, I'm not trying to pick a fight. But who would you consider a "Great of the Game" from the past, say 30 years that isn't already in the Hall of Fame, current players included? (And if you say Alejandro DeAza, I'm going to kick your ass!)
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SoxIlliniRob
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Re: HOfers

Post by SoxIlliniRob on Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:37 pm

alohafri wrote:
SoxIlliniRob wrote:I consider neither of them to be Greats of the Game.  Just really good players from some very good teams, like Buehrle or Konerko.  That said, I would actually enjoy a system that elects two former players per year, or one per year.  Pick a number.  And then it's never more, and never less.  And if Morris is the best former player on the ballot in a given year, then he makes it.

Just curious, and unlike someone else we know, I'm not trying to pick a fight. But who would you consider a "Great of the Game" from the past, say 30 years that isn't already in the Hall of Fame, current players included? (And if you say Alejandro DeAza, I'm going to kick your ass!)

I don't think you, at this point, need ever to preface something with "I'm not trying to pick a fight."  

Thome, Jeter, Pujols, Trout, Miggy, Kershaw, Scherzer, maybe Verlander, Kluber, King Felix, Votto, Cano, Altuve, Harper.

I'm not saying all of those guys should or will make the Hall.  Some will have to keep on keeping on, and some just have to finish their careers without a crash and burn.  Altuve will need to keep putting up great seasons.  

Others whose numbers are Hall-worthy, paying no respect to other aspects of their careers:  Bonds, Rose, McGwire, Palmiero, Clemens, Bagwell, maybe Piazza.  Probably a few others.
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alohafri
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Re: HOfers

Post by alohafri on Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:43 pm

SoxIlliniRob wrote:
alohafri wrote:
SoxIlliniRob wrote:I consider neither of them to be Greats of the Game.  Just really good players from some very good teams, like Buehrle or Konerko.  That said, I would actually enjoy a system that elects two former players per year, or one per year.  Pick a number.  And then it's never more, and never less.  And if Morris is the best former player on the ballot in a given year, then he makes it.

Just curious, and unlike someone else we know, I'm not trying to pick a fight. But who would you consider a "Great of the Game" from the past, say 30 years that isn't already in the Hall of Fame, current players included? (And if you say Alejandro DeAza, I'm going to kick your ass!)

I don't think you, at this point, need ever to preface something with "I'm not trying to pick a fight."  

Thome, Jeter, Pujols, Trout, Miggy, Kershaw, Scherzer, maybe Verlander, Kluber, King Felix, Votto, Cano, Altuve, Harper.

I'm not saying all of those guys should or will make the Hall.  Some will have to keep on keeping on, and some just have to finish their careers without a crash and burn.  Altuve will need to keep putting up great seasons.  

Others whose numbers are Hall-worthy, paying no respect to other aspects of their careers:  Bonds, Rose, McGwire, Palmiero, Clemens, Bagwell, maybe Piazza.  Probably a few others.

I would probably agree with most of them. Isn't Piazza in? (I was just there, I should know this, but...)
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SoxIlliniRob
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Re: HOfers

Post by SoxIlliniRob on Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:02 pm

alohafri wrote:
SoxIlliniRob wrote:
alohafri wrote:
SoxIlliniRob wrote:I consider neither of them to be Greats of the Game.  Just really good players from some very good teams, like Buehrle or Konerko.  That said, I would actually enjoy a system that elects two former players per year, or one per year.  Pick a number.  And then it's never more, and never less.  And if Morris is the best former player on the ballot in a given year, then he makes it.

Just curious, and unlike someone else we know, I'm not trying to pick a fight. But who would you consider a "Great of the Game" from the past, say 30 years that isn't already in the Hall of Fame, current players included? (And if you say Alejandro DeAza, I'm going to kick your ass!)

I don't think you, at this point, need ever to preface something with "I'm not trying to pick a fight."  

Thome, Jeter, Pujols, Trout, Miggy, Kershaw, Scherzer, maybe Verlander, Kluber, King Felix, Votto, Cano, Altuve, Harper.

I'm not saying all of those guys should or will make the Hall.  Some will have to keep on keeping on, and some just have to finish their careers without a crash and burn.  Altuve will need to keep putting up great seasons.  

Others whose numbers are Hall-worthy, paying no respect to other aspects of their careers:  Bonds, Rose, McGwire, Palmiero, Clemens, Bagwell, maybe Piazza.  Probably a few others.

I would probably agree with most of them. Isn't Piazza in? (I was just there, I should know this, but...)
 
Piazza's not in to my knowledge.  Some of the guys I noted are guys that are on their way, but who could still be derailed.  Chris Sale might end up making it, too, if he has a bunch more strong years.  That said, I've never thought of Sale as a great, because of his tendency to flame out later in the season.
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sharpy
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Re: HOfers

Post by sharpy on Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:20 pm

Piazza's not in to my knowledge. 

He made it last year ...but one guy who isn't in, and should be, Marvin Miller ...seems like people are being bitter and holding what he did against him - and not sure how the players on this committee aren't fighting for him

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